Dubbed vs Subtitled

[Haywire]

So, I posted in the Anime thread that I have been watching a lot of anime recently with my son, Haywire3, who is 5-1/2, and this has forced me to think about my preferences between dubbed and subtitled shows.

I grew up watching dubbed shows. From Godzilla and Robotech, to Speed Racer and New Adventures of Gigantor, most of my exposure to Japanese film and anime was localized through dubbing. Early on, I didn't even realize this was the case, that's just the way it was.
In the 90's, a lot of that changed, as the Heisei Godzilla films were initially only available in the US through fansubbed bootlegs. I developed a preference for subtitled versions, and even went back and collected all the Godzilla films in the original Japanese with subtitles. At one time in my naive youth, I felt like this was the ONLY TRUE WAY to watch these.

I was becoming a subtitle snob.

When my interests expanded to include anime, a similar thing happened. Those of you who remember know that when you bought anime on VHS, you had to choose between Dubbed or Subbed, and I was definitely in the Subbed camp. (DVDs offering both options were SO VERY revolutionary!) Another thing I learned about myself around this time; if I watched a show dubbed first (such as Robotech or Evangelion) I could generally watch it either dubbed or subbed. But, if I watched it subtitled first (such as Cowboy Bebop, Trigun, or Patlabor), the vocal mannerisms of the dubbed version would feel "wrong", and it was like nails on a chalkboard. (City Hunter being the one exception; I saw it dubbed first, but only watch it subtitled now.)

As I've grown older, I have developed a renewed appreciation for dubbed films. I prefer the "Godzilla vs The Smog Monster" dub to the original "Godzilla vs Hedorah", "Godzilla vs Biollante" dubbed is my default feel-good movie, and I actually enjoy watching Robotech. At the same time, dubbed versions of the shows I watch are getting fewer and farther between. I'm glad to have any version of Shin Tetsujin 28, but I do miss the New Gigantor dub. Machine Robo and Dorvack were released subtitled only. I know there are economic and/or licensing reasons for this, but it does seem like dubbing is falling by the wayside, at least for my favorite shows.

Now, I have a son that I want to share my interests with, and I'm finding I actually prefer having a dubbed version to watch with him. He's too young to read subtitles, and while he has learned some Japanese, neither of us knows enough to watch these shows untranslated. So, I feel like I've come full circle in the dubbed versus subtitled debate, which is kind of a weird feeling; it's like I didn't know how good I had it back in the day.

So, what are your opinions or thoughts on dubbed versus subbed?

 

[The Mighty Mollusk]

Depends entirely on the quality of the dub. Some are perfectly good, some are passable, and some make me want to plug my ears with a jelly donut.

 

[Sabrblade]

Depends entirely on the quality of the dub. Some are perfectly good, some are passable, and some make me want to plug my ears with a jelly donut.

Pretty much this. I'm not a sub purist, but I still expect dubs to be good enough and/or not treat the audience like idiots.

For instance, I cannot sit through the old English dub of Dragon Ball Z. The dialogue and acting are all terrible. But the English dub of Kai (even the slightly censored version that aired on Nicktoons) is VERY good. As for the original Japanese version of either Z or Kai, I'm just fine watching that too.

 

[Princess Viola]

I pretty much exclusively watch shows and movies in their original language with subtitles.

I don't have a seething hatred for dubs like some people have (and I admittedly have a bit of a spin for old obscure 80s anime dubs [and I mean like 'dubs that were just put out by companies who wanted to get some children's shows out to cash in on the growing home video market of the 80s and just licensed some Japanese cartoons for cheap because it was less expensive than making a completely original cartoon' and not like the dubs people know like Voltron or Robotech]) but it's like these things were made by their creators in the original language, so I just feel that's how I should watch them. And this goes for anything made in a foreign language, not just anime.

I'm glad dubs exist for people who are younger or genuinely can't follow subtitles (or just don't want to have to read while watching something), but they're just not for me these days.

 

[Tm_Silverclaw]

It really depends. I can usually take either in MOST times, although times the dubs -can- feel off.

If you want a good Dub I still suggest Ultraman Z and Blazar on youtube.

I think the biggest problem with the sub vs dub thing is false information we had as kids when we got such subs that often... thirteened the things. Like all the fansubs that had Vegita screaming F-bombs every few words.

Also a lot of the times "The japanese Voice actors are sooooo much better!" while, in some cases are more than likely true *as they APPEAR to treat VAs better over there than here* a lot of it I think is we just don't know the nuances in the original languages to notice if they are over-acting, or being flat or whatever.

 

[Caldwin]

Depends on a few things actually.

QUALITY OF THE DUB
This includes how well the voice actors deliver their lines, but it also depends on what lines are given and/or what's been censored. Sometimes it's not even a matter of censoring. A joke or explanation just lands better or an explanation is worded better one way or the other.

Live Action or Animated
Speaking in broad generalizations, mouth movements are more noticeable (and therefore more distracting) in live action. Their usually more well hidden in animation making it easier to go either route I feel like.

What Mood am I In
Sometimes I get home after a long day and the last thing I want to do is read captions. I may not even want to have to concentrate much at all on the movie. Dub usually works well for that.

 

[Princess Viola]

Also a lot of the times "The japanese Voice actors are sooooo much better!" while, in some cases are more than likely true *as they APPEAR to treat VAs better over there than here* a lot of it I think is we just don't know the nuances in the original languages to notice if they are over-acting, or being flat or whatever.

It's pretty much a guarantee that anytime someone says that Japanese actors are better, the person making the claims doesn't even speak a damn word of Japanese and couldn't tell good Japanese voice acting from bad Japanese voice acting.

 

[Sabrblade]

Here's another example.

Awhile back, I found on Tubi a French-original live-action movie adaptation of Beauty and the Beast, One that was more based on the original story but with a few elements from more modern adaptations added into the mix (and which was quite different from either of Disney's two movie versions). But, while it was originally made in French, the only option Tubi had for watching it (or at least, from what I could find) was an English-dubbed version.

Being a live-action production, This meant it was English voice-over dialogue coming from live actors whose lips were originally speaking French. Yet, despite the obvious differences between the two languages, somehow, the English-dubbed dialogue Not only matched the lip flaps close enough to not look awkward or distracting, the dialogue was also written and spoken in ways that made everyone's lines sound natural and believable, while also keeping true to the meaning and spirit of the original French dialogue.

While the film's story was just okay (though, still much more interesting a take on the tale than Disney's live-action version), the dub was done in a most competent and commendable manner, despite all of the usual obstacles that come with dubbing a live-action production.

 

[CoffeeHorse]

Reading doesn't bother me. It doesn't feel like I'm putting in any extra effort.

But don't make me pause to read a paragraph explaining the words you chose not to translate because their meaning is just too darned special to convey in English.

 

[Sabrblade]

Reading doesn't bother me. It doesn't feel like I'm putting in any extra effort.

But don't make me pause to read a paragraph explaining the words you chose not to translate because their meaning is just too darned special to convey in English.

That's why I love Karyuudo Fansubs's method of keeping all of the Translators' Notes out of the videos and instead placed into a separate PDF file that they include along with their episode releases.

Or in the case of their episode uploads on YouTube, placing the notes for each episode in the video descriptions.

 

[NovaSaber]

It's short translator's notes that are more likely to be things that should have just been translated.

If the explanation is a whole paragraph (and it's not bullshit), then there probably really wasn't a concise-enough direct translation.

 

[CoffeeHorse]

I am totally interested in those translators' notes. The nuances can be fascinating. But within the subs, I want to see something that works well enough. English has a lot of words. Pick something.

I guess it feels like watching something vs studying it. If there's more to it than what I'm getting out of the subs, I do want to know. I'm into it. But that feels like a different activity than trying to watch something in real time.

 

[Princess Viola]

I never got into the franchise but One Piece fansubs insisting that nakama cannot be translated into English really did give anime fans brain damage

 

[Sabrblade]

I never got into the franchise but One Piece fansubs insisting that nakama cannot be translated into English really did give anime fans brain damage

All according to cake.

(Note: "Cake" means "keikaku")

 

[LBD "Nytetrayn"]

It depends.

I first saw Dragon Ball/Z in dub form, and I prefer those voices, though earlier on, the localization kinda blew, but that got better with time. Even watching through Super now, I prefer hearing the English cast I'm familiar with.

Death Note, English is what was on TV, and I liked the cast, but otherwise, I could have gone either way.

MegaMan NT Warrior, I vastly prefer the subs. Besides the fact that the voices in NT Warrior make the characters sound ten years older than they are, I just really don't like a lot of the localization choices, right down to the title, since it effectively established two sets of localized English terms simultaneously -- not even like one of those cases where someone tried again years later to do it again. So you have the game names for everyone and everything, and the anime/manga/licensed names, so many of which were needless, pointless, or just plain ridiculous.

Watching the Japanese version subbed just feels easier and more... I dunno, pure, I guess?

Sonic X: Hated some of the content changes by 4Kids, but dub was mostly fine. Especially once the games started using the same cast.

Yu-Gi-Oh: Ditto.

Probably anything from 4Kids, in that regard, really.

Gurren Lagann, we watched the sub, because that's all Crunchyroll had for some reason, despite English credits and voice actors listed.

Mobile Suit Gundam, I think we watched subs for the same reason.

And so on. I guess most of the time, it's a matter of what's most conveniently available to us.

 

[Tm_Silverclaw]

Reading doesn't bother me. It doesn't feel like I'm putting in any extra effort.

But don't make me pause to read a paragraph explaining the words you chose not to translate because their meaning is just too darned special to convey in English.

O baka-chan-tachi

Translators note: You fools.

*No I'm not joking... That's a fricking popular sub groups actual work.*

 

[Gridlock]

I always try to go for the sub. If I see Samuel L. Jackson on the screen, I want to hear Samuel L. Jackson, not someone trying to imitate him (or sometimes not trying at all). There are some few examples of great dub in my country, with are considered classic, and even better than original (Shrek movies for example), but I havent really watch dubbed movies since I was a kid. At one point, MCU distrubutor here wanted to have only dubbed version in theaters, and fans quickly started a campaing against it, so that there would be both version instead, as it was so far.

With anime I always watch sub. The reason for that probably is, that I tried watching Dragon Ball Z by Funimation (the first one), and it was just godawful, the voices (not a single dub Freeza so far could hold a candle to his Japanese voice actor), the script changes, the terrible awful music... This experience turned me off to dubs for good, and while I know that quality is much better this days then back then, I simply don't really care anymore. 10 out of 10 cases I will always pick sub for anime.

(On the other hand, I have no problem with DBZ Abridged dub. Maybe because it's a parody.)

Thought of course, this is written from a perspective of a 36 year old. I can understand why children would rather watch a dub version. I was one of them once.

 

[Fero McPigletron]

I watched all of 2011 Hunter x Hunter in two weeks, all in dub.

Currently watching Delicous in Dungeon in dub. I'd love to watch Campfire Cooking Outside in Another World in dub so I can just put it in the background and hear the cooking and the drooling.

Waiting for Demon Slayer next season, all in sub.

I'm either ok.

 

[Princess Viola]

Speaking of subs leaving basic words untranslated, this anime called Go Princess Precure (one of the Precures seasons, as you probably figure from the name of the series) has a character named Miss Shamour who peppers her dialogue with random English words.

This series also has two different groups who did fansubs for it.

One of the groups just translated her dialogue normally, they didn't really do anything in regards to the English words she said. Like she would greet the protagonists by saying 'Gogiken'you everyone' and since 'gokigen'you' just translates to like 'How do you do?', they subtitled that line simply as 'How do you do, everyone?' (or something like that, it's been a few years since I saw the series)

But the other sub group replaced the English in the subtitles with French, which wouldn't have been an issue (in fact - I actually kind of like when subtitles do that. If a character peppers their dialogue with words in a foreign language and the subtitles are in said language, replace those words with a different language to give the same effect in the subtitles) if not for the fact that the subtitles for her lines just had random French words used in them for translations of words she was saying in Japanese.

The result was just like one of those bad fansubs with half the words left in Japanese except half the words were in French.

I'm not gonna drop screenshots here but like here's some lines as they were translated in the good fansubs vs the fansubs that did this random French words jive:
- 'You are the students taking the princess lessons, right?' vs 'Vous three are ma élèves de princesse.'

- 'This is English-style afternoon tea, right?' vs 'This is an English-style thé de l'après-midi, correct?' (this line wasn't even said by her but the sub group had to do this to maintain consistency)

- 'The lesson is "How to greet guests with afternoon tea!"' vs 'That is la forme of hospitality known as le thé de l'après-midi!'

It was just so frigging bad and I'm glad I didn't watch the show with these ouiaboo subtitles.

 

[CoffeeHorse]

Sonic X:

I forgive 4Kids for one reason. They found Mike Pollock.