Transformers movie and season 3: how could they have been done better and got a full season 4 and maybe more seasons?

Haywire

Collecter of Gobots and Godzilla
Citizen
Back then, Hasbro was a toy company. The comics and cartoon were nothing more than glorified ads To Sell Toys. Anything else with Transformers on it was just standard merchandising (read that in Mel Brooks' Yogurt voice) for the time, and quickly disappeared once the fad status was over. It wasn't really until the late 90s to early 2000s before that attitude changed towards Transformers. The Dreamwave G1 comics (love 'em or hate 'em) were probably the first licensed media that wasn't directly promoting an existing toyline, but it was surely the success of the live-action movies that cemented the idea that the Transformers could be sold as a licensed brand beyond just toys and toy-promoting stuff.
 

Sabrblade

Continuity Nutcase
Citizen
The Dreamwave G1 comics (love 'em or hate 'em) were probably the first licensed media that wasn't directly promoting an existing toyline
On the other hand, there were ads for the Toys 'R' Us G1 toy reissues in the back of Dreamwave's G1 comic issues. ;)
 

CoffeeHorse

Exhausted, but still standing.
Staff member
Council of Elders
Citizen
Someone had to learn the lesson the hard way, and it ended up being Hasbro with Optimus Prime. But it did make the movie a lot more memorable, so it was a double edged sword. By now I'm sure the money they've made from it is well worth it.
 

Steevy Maximus

Well known pompous pontificator
Citizen
Season 4 didn't continue beyond "The Rebirth" also because the TV networks were done with Transformers. It was considered old news by that point. In 1987, the new hot stuff for kids were Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and DuckTales. Those were what the networks were interested in.
I think to be more accurate, the issue wasn't necessarily that Transformers was just "old news", so much that there was just SO MUCH STUFF hitting the market. GI Joe, Masters of the Universe and Transformers set the mold for successful toy lines, and it was formula that EVERYONE tried to copy due to the success Hasbro and Mattel had with those brands. Hasbro, themselves, were trying to launch lines like Inhumanoids and Visionaries. The "market understanding" of the time was a good toy line MIGHT last 3-4 years. By 1987, Transformers and GI Joe had defied those expectations.
By 1987, most of those First Generation brands were winding down, to some extent (Transformers, GI Joe, MOTU, MASK, Thundercats) and the Second Generation was being launched with new lines (The Real Ghostbusters, COPS, TMNT, Silverhawks, Dino-Riders). GI Joe and Transformers were the only brands to survive thanks to reinvention and market momentum. Even still, despite no new content, Hasbro still kept the shows in syndication for brand exposure.
 

Soundwave2.0

Member
Citizen
I think to be more accurate, the issue wasn't necessarily that Transformers was just "old news", so much that there was just SO MUCH STUFF hitting the market. GI Joe, Masters of the Universe and Transformers set the mold for successful toy lines, and it was formula that EVERYONE tried to copy due to the success Hasbro and Mattel had with those brands. Hasbro, themselves, were trying to launch lines like Inhumanoids and Visionaries. The "market understanding" of the time was a good toy line MIGHT last 3-4 years. By 1987, Transformers and GI Joe had defied those expectations.
By 1987, most of those First Generation brands were winding down, to some extent (Transformers, GI Joe, MOTU, MASK, Thundercats) and the Second Generation was being launched with new lines (The Real Ghostbusters, COPS, TMNT, Silverhawks, Dino-Riders). GI Joe and Transformers were the only brands to survive thanks to reinvention and market momentum. Even still, despite no new content, Hasbro still kept the shows in syndication for brand exposure.
Will you please what was the accurate reason the Transformers cartoon was ended and why was Optimus Prime brought back when the show did not last much longer?
 

Darth_Prime

Well-known member
Citizen
He was brought back in a last ditch effort to keep the show going. He didn’t last long on Headmaster IIRC. One cool episode, Double Convoy. Got to see Optimus and Rodimus together.
 

Dekafox

Fabulously Foxy Dragon
Citizen
It's worth noting that the original ending to Dark Awakening on its first airing explicitly blew Zombie Optimus up - the teaser for Op's return didn't happen until later airings. That says the return of Optimus episodes were definitely a last minute reaction to the movie(and possibly the Dark Awakening episode's ratings) when production for the season was almost complete.
 

Soundwave2.0

Member
Citizen
He was brought back in a last ditch effort to keep the show going. He didn’t last long on Headmaster IIRC. One cool episode, Double Convoy. Got to see Optimus and Rodimus together.
What if they had turned Optimus into Ultra Magnus like they did with Megatron into Galvatron or not just not killed him at all?
 

Sabrblade

Continuity Nutcase
Citizen
What if they had turned Optimus into Ultra Magnus like they did with Megatron into Galvatron or not just not killed him at all?
We can speculate on What-ifs all we want. The fact of the matter is that 1980s Hasbro wanted Optimus Prime killed off above all other characters, because to them he was just a piece of merchandise to be sold for two years and then discarded in the third year, tossed to the wind to make room for more newer pieces of merchandise.
 

CoffeeHorse

Exhausted, but still standing.
Staff member
Council of Elders
Citizen
Kids' attention would have gone elsewhere eventually. All killing Prime did was make him more memorable when kids looked back years later.
 

Sabrblade

Continuity Nutcase
Citizen
All killing Prime did was make him more memorable when kids looked back years later.
Which also had an unfortunate side effect that painted Rodimus in a bad light in those people's memories.
 

Soundwave2.0

Member
Citizen
Which also had an unfortunate side effect that painted Rodimus in a bad light in those people's memories.
Would it have been easier for Rodimus to be accepted if he did not have anything to do with what happened with Optimus at all and keep the show going?
 

CoffeeHorse

Exhausted, but still standing.
Staff member
Council of Elders
Citizen
Probably. People are still hung up on blaming Hot Rod for their childhood trauma.

But at least people cared about what happened. We might not be here today if the status quo had limped along until nobody cared anymore. Transformers would have faded out eventually. That natural fadeout was interrupted by a whole season of "I want Optimus Prime back." It's no wonder Transformers nostalgia still exists. It got a chance to start before the show was even over.
 

Sabrblade

Continuity Nutcase
Citizen
If anything, they could have eased the transition from Optimus to Rodimus a bit.

Like, have it be that Hot Rod still attempted to tackle Megatron, but accidentally tripped and wound up jumping in between Optimus and Megatron, taking the shot from Megatron meant for Optimus. Hot Rod would then be the one wounded in this scene, prompting Optimus to avenge him and still pummel Megatron like in the final version of the movie. Hot Rod would then be the one who is treated, and actually recover (since he was a new toy at the time, so he's gotta recover).

Optimus would then be under the impression that Hot Rod took the shot on purpose and bravely through himself between Optimus and Megatron to save Prime's life, unaware that Hot Rod was actually just trying to show off. He'd thus sense some hidden potential in Hot Rod and take him under his wing, following him around for the rest of the movie. Hot Rod, however, would not reciprocate Prime's new interest in him because he (Hot Rod) would instead feel that he actually blundered his big moment to be a hero and think Prime is teasing him, unaware that Optimus's interest in him is sincere.

The rest of the movie would basically play out the same, only with Optimus joining Hot Rod, Kup, and the Dinobots on their voyage to Cybertron while the others go with Ultra Magnus (to whom Optimus would have still given the Matrix, but to keep it safe as he'd sense its being in danger and would use himself as a decoy to divert Galvatron away from the Matrix, unaware that Unicron could sense the Matrix in Magnus and direct Galvatron to him instead of Prime). When Prime, Hot Rod, Kup, and Dinobots would reunite with the others on Junkion, Optimus would realize his mistake of putting Magnus in danger (since the Decepticons blew him up to get the Matrix), and around this point, Hot Rod would recognize that even Optimus is not infallible and the two would finally have a long-awaited moment of reconciliation, allowing Hot Rod to mature a bit more in foreshadowing things yet to come.

During the final battle inside Unicron, one of two things could then play out. Either Hot Rod gets separated from everyone and still retrieves the Matrix from Galvatron by himself (like in the final movie), with Optimus ending up with the others... OR, both Hot Rod and Optimus get separated from the others and team up to get the Matrix back from Galvatron together, with Optimus personally witnessing Hot Rod's transformation into Rodimus Prime. Either way, after Unicron blows up, the final scene on Cybertron could see Optimus officially passing leadership over to Rodimus, with Optimus stepping down in retirement and showing to the movie's young viewers that he is personally endorsing Rodimus as the new leader, letting them know that this is an acceptable thing. It's okay to like Rodimus Prime, kids.

Or, if Optimus still has to die, he could have done so when teaming up with Hot Rod to try taking the Matrix back from Galvatron, making a heroic sacrifice to ensure that Hot Rod gets the Matrix and becomes Rodimus Prime. After Rodimus would throw Galvatron out of Unicron, he and Optimus would have one final farewell scene before Rodimus opens the Matrix, with Optimus basically saying that this is something that must happen, "Do not grieve", "'Till all are one", etc. Otherwise, I can't see Optimus having as emotionally meaningful a death if he instead ends up with the others separated from Hot Rod. Anyway, the final scene would thus be a little more melancholic and not quite as triumphant as in the final movie, but perhaps it could be spun as less of a sad farewell to Optimus and more of an honorable "Thank you for everything/I promise to live up to your example" kind of example to end the film on a more hopeful note. The final speech given in the actual movie could still be used to close it out with some sense of triumph, at least.

In other words, this is more or less how I wish Deviations had gone down.
 

CoffeeHorse

Exhausted, but still standing.
Staff member
Council of Elders
Citizen
Keeping Prime around that long would break a few things. Optimus and Megatron's duel to the death becomes just another fight if neither one of them dies. Hot Rod having Optimus around as a mentor means he doesn't need Kup for that, erasing their whole arc. Matrix or not, Ultra Magnus' stint as leader and apparent death on Junkion becomes meaningless if Optimus is still alive to simply retake command when he's ready.

The movie is no masterpiece but it does some things right.
 

Sabrblade

Continuity Nutcase
Citizen
Keeping Prime around that long would break a few things. Optimus and Megatron's duel to the death becomes just another fight if neither one of them dies. Hot Rod having Optimus around as a mentor means he doesn't need Kup for that, erasing their whole arc. Matrix or not, Ultra Magnus' stint as leader and apparent death on Junkion becomes meaningless if Optimus is still alive to simply retake command when he's ready.

The movie is no masterpiece but it does some things right.
So what you're saying is that the entire premise of Deviations was built on a concept doomed to fail no matter what. ;)
 

Soundwave2.0

Member
Citizen
If anything, they could have eased the transition from Optimus to Rodimus a bit.

Like, have it be that Hot Rod still attempted to tackle Megatron, but accidentally tripped and wound up jumping in between Optimus and Megatron, taking the shot from Megatron meant for Optimus. Hot Rod would then be the one wounded in this scene, prompting Optimus to avenge him and still pummel Megatron like in the final version of the movie. Hot Rod would then be the one who is treated, and actually recover (since he was a new toy at the time, so he's gotta recover).

Optimus would then be under the impression that Hot Rod took the shot on purpose and bravely through himself between Optimus and Megatron to save Prime's life, unaware that Hot Rod was actually just trying to show off. He'd thus sense some hidden potential in Hot Rod and take him under his wing, following him around for the rest of the movie. Hot Rod, however, would not reciprocate Prime's new interest in him because he (Hot Rod) would instead feel that he actually blundered his big moment to be a hero and think Prime is teasing him, unaware that Optimus's interest in him is sincere.

The rest of the movie would basically play out the same, only with Optimus joining Hot Rod, Kup, and the Dinobots on their voyage to Cybertron while the others go with Ultra Magnus (to whom Optimus would have still given the Matrix, but to keep it safe as he'd sense its being in danger and would use himself as a decoy to divert Galvatron away from the Matrix, unaware that Unicron could sense the Matrix in Magnus and direct Galvatron to him instead of Prime). When Prime, Hot Rod, Kup, and Dinobots would reunite with the others on Junkion, Optimus would realize his mistake of putting Magnus in danger (since the Decepticons blew him up to get the Matrix), and around this point, Hot Rod would recognize that even Optimus is not infallible and the two would finally have a long-awaited moment of reconciliation, allowing Hot Rod to mature a bit more in foreshadowing things yet to come.

During the final battle inside Unicron, one of two things could then play out. Either Hot Rod gets separated from everyone and still retrieves the Matrix from Galvatron by himself (like in the final movie), with Optimus ending up with the others... OR, both Hot Rod and Optimus get separated from the others and team up to get the Matrix back from Galvatron together, with Optimus personally witnessing Hot Rod's transformation into Rodimus Prime. Either way, after Unicron blows up, the final scene on Cybertron could see Optimus officially passing leadership over to Rodimus, with Optimus stepping down in retirement and showing to the movie's young viewers that he is personally endorsing Rodimus as the new leader, letting them know that this is an acceptable thing. It's okay to like Rodimus Prime, kids.

Or, if Optimus still has to die, he could have done so when teaming up with Hot Rod to try taking the Matrix back from Galvatron, making a heroic sacrifice to ensure that Hot Rod gets the Matrix and becomes Rodimus Prime. After Rodimus would throw Galvatron out of Unicron, he and Optimus would have one final farewell scene before Rodimus opens the Matrix, with Optimus basically saying that this is something that must happen, "Do not grieve", "'Till all are one", etc. Otherwise, I can't see Optimus having as emotionally meaningful a death if he instead ends up with the others separated from Hot Rod. Anyway, the final scene would thus be a little more melancholic and not quite as triumphant as in the final movie, but perhaps it could be spun as less of a sad farewell to Optimus and more of an honorable "Thank you for everything/I promise to live up to your example" kind of example to end the film on a more hopeful note. The final speech given in the actual movie could still be used to close it out with some sense of triumph, at least.

In other words, this is more or less how I wish Deviations had gone down.
Could the show had went on longer had they turned Optimus into Ultra Magnus, just leave him alive and as his or make step down as leader and him still be a part of the cast of season 3 as something else?
 


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