Transformers Legacy toyline

[PrimalxConvoy]

Sure, they could do that. They could do lots of things, but probably won't at this point.

I'm thinking of whatever would be quick, cheap, easy, and not leave a bunch of naked Decepticons wandering around peoples' homes in the dead of night.

I don't understand about the naked 'Cons, but the idea I proposed is pretty easy. They could also reuse the titanmaster gimmick and do it that way for both pretenders and powermasters.

For example, Bludgeon could be a core "master" block bot (in his core robot colours) and have a small green tank/weapon that he can combine with and a Pretender shell that turns into a vehicle and Samurai Skeleton. The mini green tank could attach to one of his arms via 5mm ports (further homaging the original toy) and the inner blockbot could go inside a cavity (such as inside an opening chest). Voila, pretender. We could also use our existing mini Bludgeon Pretender as extra armour/play value of we wanted. Heck, they could even use done if that rubbery plastic they use for swords for various parts of the shells to simulate "skin", etc.

 

[lastmaximal]

At some point you have to start asking if you're still producing a good toy that works in tandem with the rest of the line, or just hell-bent on producing something, anything, that can be wadded up and put in a shell, for the sake of saying you have something you can put in a shell.

 

[unluckiness]

Pretenders didn't even bother with the inner robot most of the time, so I think it's an acceptable compromise to cut out the middleman and have the shells transform into approximations of the inner robot's altmode.

 

[PrimalxConvoy]

At some point you have to start asking if you're still producing a good toy that works in tandem with the rest of the line, or just hell-bent on producing something, anything, that can be wadded up and put in a shell, for the sake of saying you have something you can put in a shell.

If the new line was basically pretenders and powermasters, then the toys would be good and work in a unified play pattern with each other. However, popping a Titanmaster in a small compartment is no different than a matrix or internal weapon storage IMO. Also, we're getting (and have gotten) combiners, Targetmasters and all sorts of other figures in the Legacy line, so Pretenders and Powermasters don't really need to "work in tandem" with any other figures, right?

 

[Badgertron]

The main problem with Pretenders for me was that the way they did them in G1, the shells were very fragile, with tabs that were easily broken. It also lead to limited articulation and an inability for the main shells themselves to really DO anything. Any modern rendition would need to be smaller figures that go just inside the torso. Maybe some panels open like CW Ultra Magnus. It would probably be better if the shells could transform into something the smaller robots could ride in. It's a shame Core class is mostly going away, as this would have been a great use for that price point.

 

[unluckiness]

Personally, the characters are what make the Pretenders prominent and I find the very concept of pretenders flawed and in need of reworking. If the gimmick of your toyline is that you can completely ignore the existence of half the package, it's not a very good one is it? Maybe if putting the robots inside the shells activated features of some kind, there'd be a selling point but as it is, if you can't even tell if the robot is inside, what's the point? Schrodinger's bot is a decent thought experiment, not so much a product.

Also, now that I think on it, Hasbro may not be willing to dilute the brand by populating the toyline with knockoff Centurions, bootleg Ninja Turtle mutants and He-Man rejects for a few years.

 

[Magnusblitz]

Yeah, toy-wise I think my ideal way to do Pretender updates would be "brute mode" types where the shells are instead additional armor in robot mode and trailer/accessory pieces in vehicle mode. Thinking guys like Energon Landmine or the PotP Leaders. I think this could work pretty well for the 'cons, as the monster theme lends itself to an armor design. Might be a bit thematically weird for the Autobots but could do it more IDW1 style where they don't have human shells, just human-esque looking protective suits.

The big drawback obviously would be size constraints, as all the examples are Ultras/Leaders and I'm not sure if even a Voyager would be doable this way. And it's a difficult gimmick to engineer for every different toy. But I can dream.

 

[PrimalxConvoy]

If the gimmick of your toyline is that you can completely ignore the existence of half the package, it's not a very good one is it?

You mean, like how combiners, Headmasters, Targetmasters, Brainmasters and Powermasters basically hide the smaller robots away to complete a larger robot? In the case of combiners or Headmasters, the larger robot isn't even complete without the smaller robots.

 

[LordGigaIce]

Honestly I prefer how they're treated now. Designs that mix the inner robot and shell design. I have no interest in trying to make the shell concept work.

You mean, like how combiners, Headmasters, Targetmasters, Brainmasters and Powermasters basically hide the smaller robots away to complete a larger robot?

No, not at all.

 

[unluckiness]

I don't know why I have to point this out but if you leave combiner parts out, you form a big robot missing limbs if you can get anything at all. Conversely, you can keep Pretender shells empty and short of picking them up and shaking them, nobody is the wiser.

Yeah, toy-wise I think my ideal way to do Pretender updates would be "brute mode" types where the shells are instead additional armor in robot mode and trailer/accessory pieces in vehicle mode. Thinking guys like Energon Landmine or the PotP Leaders. I think this could work pretty well for the 'cons, as the monster theme lends itself to an armor design. Might be a bit thematically weird for the Autobots but could do it more IDW1 style where they don't have human shells, just human-esque looking protective suits.

The big drawback obviously would be size constraints, as all the examples are Ultras/Leaders and I'm not sure if even a Voyager would be doable this way. And it's a difficult gimmick to engineer for every different toy. But I can dream.

I think it could work as the successors to the Weaponizers. Make a robot that can reassemble into a vehicle or be disassembled into armor that is compatible with most figures but has extra functionality with their intended character. Release a deluxe Octopunch who turns into a crab and release deluxe Pretender™ Flotsam who turns into a boat and disassemble into gloves, boots chest armor and weapons that make Octopunch look like his shell. This also means you can put the diving bell helmet on other figures for lols.

Of course this isn't practical for every Pretender design.

 

[Platypus Prime]

The new line will be the TherapyMasters, representing all the things kids from the 80's saw RUINED FOREVER as the concepts were JaAm'd into a modern era with different budget requirements and material cost estimates.

TherapyMasters hide their deep seated inferiority complexes inside!

The tech specs will be nothing but micro-scaled printouts of internet arguments about the figures themselves.

 

[PrimalxConvoy]

I don't know why I have to point this out but if you leave combiner parts out, you form a big robot missing limbs if you can get anything at all. Conversely, you can keep Pretender shells empty and short of picking them up and shaking them, nobody is the wiser.

Your original point was that a Pretender robot can be "assimilated" or "lost" inside another form/robot, which negated their purpose. However, I pointed out that from a certain POV, a similar thing happens with combiners, etc. To make one character "whole" we effectively "lose" the other/s.

 

[PrimalxConvoy]

The new line will be the TherapyMasters, representing all the things kids from the 80's saw RUINED FOREVER as the concepts were JaAm'd into a modern era with different budget requirements and material cost estimates.

TherapyMasters hide their deep seated inferiority complexes inside!

The tech specs will be nothing but micro-scaled printouts of internet arguments about the figures themselves.

 

[unluckiness]

Your original point was that a Pretender robot can be "assimilated" or "lost" inside another form/robot, which negated their purpose. However, I pointed out that from a certain POV, a similar thing happens with combiners, etc. To make one character "whole" we effectively "lose" the other/s.

I don't even know where you pulled that assimilated or lost stuff from. My point is that an empty pretender shell is functionally identical to an occupied one.

 

[PrimalxConvoy]

I don't even know where you pulled that assimilated or lost stuff from. My point is that an empty pretender shell is functionally identical to an occupied one.

You wrote:

- "If the gimmick of your toyline is that you can completely ignore the existence of half the package, it's not a very good one is it?"

And my point (again) is that Powermasters and Targetmasters, etc are arguably "half the package" and could, technically, be ignored. If we lost the little robots that turned into guns or engine blocks, we could still play with the main robots. However, as fans, I think most of us here have lamented when characters meant to be Headmasters, etc haven't come with their requisite head/engine/weapon bots.

Also, the weapons (which in some cases, formed part of the core robot, such as Bludgeon's turret, etc) were also the weapons and/or shields, etc for the Pretender shell. It's also worth noting that the role-playing part of the play pattern (which admittedly might not be known to all kids that played with them) was that the shells couldn't operate on their own. They were controlled by the inner robot, much like how Roller and the trailer are controlled by Optimus Prime.

 

[LordGigaIce]

I assume the action figure buying public of the year of our lord 2000 + 24 expects new product to be more articulate than rubbery plastic shells sold in the 80s.

So now you're essentially trying to engineer a fully functional action figure that hides another action figure that can transform convert into a vehicle inside.

I don't see any way to do this that doesn't compromise one or both. And at that point I have to echo...

At some point you have to start asking if you're still producing a good toy that works in tandem with the rest of the line, or just hell-bent on producing something, anything, that can be wadded up and put in a shell, for the sake of saying you have something you can put in a shell.

The way they treat Pretenders now is fine, and fans from the 80s frankly need to accept that this is the one gimmick that likely can't be replicated the way other line wide gimmicks have been.

 

[Blot]

You don't understand. The children, they long for the space barbarians with Tom Selleck mustaches.

 

[LordGigaIce]

You don't understand. The children, they long for the space barbarians with Tom Selleck mustaches.

The whole Pretender thing never worked for me. I guess some of the Decepticons work because they're monsters but who the hell is seeing a giant human (big enough to hold a Transformer inside) in knock-off He-Man armour and going "seems legit!"

 

[PrimalxConvoy]

Release Date: August 2024
Retail Price: $142.97 CAD

Exclusive offer: Receive a bonus Transformers Collector Box when you purchase the following four Transformers Legacy action figures together:

Transformers Legacy United Deluxe Class Robots in Disguise 2001 Universe Autobot Side Burn

Transformers Legacy United Deluxe Class Infernac Universe Nucleous

Transformers Legacy United Deluxe Class Cybertron Universe Hot Shot

Transformers Legacy United Deluxe Class Robots in Disguise 2015 Universe Strongarm

Box details: Corrugate store and stage box

Specifications

Assembled Depth (in.): 16.000 in
Assembled Length (in.): 12.000 in
Assembled Width (in.): 3.000 in
Assembled Weight (lbs.): 10.8800 lb
Category ID: CAT-6000196264542
SKU: 6000207958525
Universal Product Code (UPC check): 628069388626
Walmart Exclusive: Yes
Walmart Item #50524610

(Source: - https://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/transformers-collector-box-and-action-figure-bundle-multi/6000207958525 )

 

[lastmaximal]

If the new line was basically pretenders and powermasters, then the toys would be good and work in a unified play pattern with each other. However, popping a Titanmaster in a small compartment is no different than a matrix or internal weapon storage IMO. Also, we're getting (and have gotten) combiners, Targetmasters and all sorts of other figures in the Legacy line, so Pretenders and Powermasters don't really need to "work in tandem" with any other figures, right?

I'm totally lost on the logic here. If you have to mangle the point that much to be "right", guess what? You're not right.

"They'll work in tandem with the rest of the line if they ARE the rest of the line", is hilarious even on its own. That's like saying a product is made "waterproof" by keeping it away from all possible sources of water. Or saying Animated Optimus works in tandem with the rest of the line, but only if the rest of the line is Animated Bumblebee and Animated Prowl.

"They'll work in tandem with the rest of the line if they ARE the rest of the line" becomes even sillier in the context of a thread about Transformers Legacy, the whole point of which is a mixing of lines and gimmicks and having everything be able to make aesthetic and play sense next to each other. In a conversation that has been about finding a way to do that with Pretenders in a way that makes sense at modern retail.

Which is doubly confusing because you ALSO talk about other gimmick representatives in Legacy fitting right in with other designs and characters in Legacy -- combiner bots stand side by side with Targetmasters who stand side by side with Junkions who stand side by side with regular bots -- as support for your point that Pretenders somehow don't need to do that?