Transformers Legacy toyline

[lastmaximal]

I recall there started being a push to use toy designs in the comic around All Hail Megatron, so we'd start seeing things like Universe Sunstreaker's look.

If I were Hasbro I'd have just asked for a Titans Return miniseries or something, disconnected from the main comic. Or run it as backup stories in the main comic.

Have Cerebros and Zarak as leaders, focus on the Headmasters and Masterforce era cast. Little one-and-dones about finding more Titan Masters and ultimately finding Fortress Maximus and Scorponok.

That would've been pretty fun stuff on its own, but I guess it might've been viewed as either confusing or dividing the audience.

 

[Sabrblade]

No, but the launch of a G1 comic and a G1 reissue line that used the new comic's art seems like a bit more than just a coincidence.

Everything Hasbro put out at that time used Dreamwave art. It was Hasbro's new "house style".

And Commemorative Series did not begin using Dreamwave art. The first few waves used the original G1 box art instead.

If Dreamwave had been writing stories to advertise the Commemorative Series line specifically, then the very first Dreamwave storyline would have put the spotlight on Optimus Prime, Ultra Magnus, and Hot Rod using the name Rodimus Major.

 

[LordGigaIce]

I'd argue there was some cross promotion there. Dreamwave is, after all, the first time Ultra Magnus' inner white Optimus Prime-esque robot was canonized in the West and that is very specifically a thing the toy can do.
And while DW didn't focus exclusively on whoever the latest reissues were, it was the first piece of G1-centric fiction in a while that hit when G1 toys were reissued in packaging that used DW art.

I don't think a lot of this was necessarily micromanaged, but you could buy G1 comics and buy G1 toys at the same time for the first time since the Marvel heyday.

Regardless, I feel like the argument here is academic. As far as IDW goes, it went through phases. And while IDW's early phase was detached from any ongoing toyline that had absolutely changed by the time Titans Return launched, and their half-hearted attempt to promote the toys led to a less than ideal story.

That would've been pretty fun stuff on its own, but I guess it might've been viewed as either confusing or dividing the audience.

The comic buying public is used to stand-alones and one-offs and mini series. I don't think it would have been an issue.
I just think that if you want to spend money to aquire the TF licence for media then you need to be ready to sell some toys. And being strangely resistant to that results in sub-par work when John Hasbro finally does call.

 

[lastmaximal]

I think the DW G1 comic/toy overlap was largely coincidental, in that G1 was experiencing a huge revival at the time and both avenues were being used to cash in on it. They weren't actively promoting one another (beyond ads and blurbs). Sure, there'll be some cast crossover, but it's not like either was NOT going to use Optimus Prime or Jazz or Bumblebee. I think the toy half of things was just not at the level yet that it could even do that -- first of all, it was a reissue side line to pad things out, not something they were actively developing and investing in anew. They were finding out what molds were even available, verifying what safety-rule-mandated changes were needed, and so on. Plus the brand team's priority was the main line (I miss the days when some flavor of G1 was not the main line) which DID have a comic explicitly promoting it.

At most, Hasbro and especially Takara (with the gorgeous book-box reissues I sorely want to see revisited) leaned into using the artwork for a lot of stuff, but that was it. It wasn't like Shockwave being the big bad of War and Peace was accompanied by a Shockwave reissue. (Even the Alternator was a year away from the tail end of the ongoing where he showed up again, and even that would've been a streeetch.)

To use a metaphor, they weren't playing together, more like parallel play.

The comic buying public is used to stand-alones and one-offs and mini series. I don't think it would have been an issue.

I don't disagree, but I think I was considering it more in terms of IDW as a publisher with perhaps smaller margins than the traditional big two -- and at the time they already had a number of things running alongside the "main" books, which were already two books. Churning out another book per month might have not been seen as a good use of money (debatable), considering they also had Revolution and TAAO and other events and series going. And the movie books had themselves gotten wrapped up before even AOE, meaning one less non-IDWG1 continuity being published. (This is why I thought of shorter "backup" stories in each issue instead, but that would have complicated page allotments for the main book and for ads and whatnot.)

Plus I guess an alternate-continuity thing was not exactly something Barber would have entertained at a time when they were deliberately welding together a big sprawling shared universe. (The alternate-continuity part of my suggestion was specifically so that their main G1 stories could proceed unaffected by new stories and plot devices and maybe different characterization for guys like Chromedome and Krok.)

(I mean, they did years before this put out a bunch of miniseries set in Aligned, so it's not like they were always averse to this.)

 

[LBD "Nytetrayn"]

If I were Hasbro I'd have just asked for a Titans Return miniseries or something, disconnected from the main comic. Or run it as backup stories in the main comic.

Yes! This is what I meant before. I'd rather have just had like a 3-year story or something covering Prime Wars as its own thing, rather than shoehorning sometimes clumsily into the regular IDW continuity (and making it even harder to follow in retrospect from all the titles they had floating around. Primus help you if you weren't reading these as they came out...).

 

[The Mighty Mollusk]

The Hasbroverse killed late IDW1 for me. I don't care about Visionairies or MASK or Rom or whatever else, I just wanted to see Transformers.

 

[Destron D-69]

yeah, when what's her name -the hot one- from Visionairies killed Ironhide I was like well okay now I don't need to read this anymore

 

[Sabrblade]

I believe I've said it before and I shall say it again: Not every Transformers fan is also a G.I. Joe fan.

 

[LordGigaIce]

Churning out another book per month might have not been seen as a good use of money (debatable), considering they also had Revolution and TAAO and other events and series going.

That's on IDW. More Transformers content might have juiced sales (even if it was a one-off Titans Return tie-in) than that G-d awful MASK series. Or trying to make the Visionaries a thing.

And yeah, it is IDW's fault. They went to Hasbro to pitch the shaded universe idea, not the other way around.

 

[Rhinox]

So I went to another city yesterday for other things and managed to find new toys. Found Slipstream (yay for preorder cancellation!) and MotorMaster. I wasn't going to get Motormaster, but, well I was depressed and desperate for some dopamine so I grabbed him and Ratchet, his wavemate.

It's still the animated Prime mold, but that's not a bad thing. And the new headsculpt is just awesome. He looks great. And the mold he uses is one of the best to come out of Legacy.

 

[LordGigaIce]

The Hasbroverse killed late IDW1 for me. I don't care about Visionairies or MASK or Rom or whatever else, I just wanted to see Transformers.

I'd say that Skybound does it properly. One, they're not flooding the market with concepts and titles.
Two, because of this they've just focused on Transformers and GI Joe (as far as Hasbro properties go, I know there's also original IP in the Energon Universe).
Three, because the focus is just on those two, each can tell its own story. You don't need to read the GI Joe stuff to follow the Transformers ongoing. It's there. They do tie in now and then, but you can skip all the GI Joe comics and still fully follow the Transformers stuff.
IDW tied so many things together and tried to make so many things interconnected and relevant and it's like... if you're just there for Transformers then no you don't care about the Space Knights or Matt Tracker's vigilante urban infrastructure repair crew (I'm not kidding) and the rest is just unwanted noise.

The era of big event crossovers in comics really did a number on "shared universes" because Marvel and DC kept pumping out mega crossover events to the point that they lost all meaning and the comic industry is, ultimately, one of follow the leader(s).

The reality is that the best way to handle a shared universe is just let different titles exist in the same fictional world but let them do their own things. Have an overall editor to make sure there aren't any huge contradictions across multiple creative teams, but let each title just exist and tell its own story, with a few connective bits here and there for the people who dig that thing.

This is especially true where Hasbro is concerned. The list of potential IPs for a shared universe is long, but it's a mile wide and an inch deep. Most of these IPs- Visionaries, Rom, MASK- are dead brands that can't be revived just by welding them to Transformers.

If you're going to do a shaded Hasbro universe then you need to start small. Transformers (their most viable and visible brand) and GI Joe (struggling but probably #2 by default) are the best choices. And just let them grow on their own.

And MAYBE, if things break right, you try a Rom comic down the line or something, and see how that does as a self-contained story before having him meet Optimus Prime.

 

[Shadewing]

I'd say that Skybound does it properly. One, they're not flooding the market with concepts and titles.
Two, because of this they've just focused on Transformers and GI Joe (as far as Hasbro properties go, I know there's also original IP in the Energon Universe).
Three, because the focus is just on those two, each can tell its own story. You don't need to read the GI Joe stuff to follow the Transformers ongoing. It's there. They do tie in now and then, but you can skip all the GI Joe comics and still fully follow the Transformers stuff.
IDW tied so many things together and tried to make so many things interconnected and relevant and it's like... if you're just there for Transformers then no you don't care about the Space Knights or Matt Tracker's vigilante urban infrastructure repair crew (I'm not kidding) and the rest is just unwanted noise.

The era of big event crossovers in comics really did a number on "shared universes" because Marvel and DC kept pumping out mega crossover events to the point that they lost all meaning and the comic industry is, ultimately, one of follow the leader(s).

The reality is that the best way to handle a shared universe is just let different titles exist in the same fictional world but let them do their own things. Have an overall editor to make sure there aren't any huge contradictions across multiple creative teams, but let each title just exist and tell its own story, with a few connective bits here and there for the people who dig that thing.

This is especially true where Hasbro is concerned. The list of potential IPs for a shared universe is long, but it's a mile wide and an inch deep. Most of these IPs- Visionaries, Rom, MASK- are dead brands that can't be revived just by welding them to Transformers.

If you're going to do a shaded Hasbro universe then you need to start small. Transformers (their most viable and visible brand) and GI Joe (struggling but probably #2 by default) are the best choices. And just let them grow on their own.

And MAYBE, if things break right, you try a Rom comic down the line or something, and see how that does as a self-contained story before having him meet Optimus Prime.

I could pretty easily see Rom working with Void Rivals and the Space stuff if done right. Set up the Space Knights as something like the Green Lanterns or Nova Corps; and them be kinda law enforcement for space. Have them slowly get pulled into things through other missions they are on. Like maybe ROM is investigating Skuxxoid's dealings, which leads him to the VR main characters which also ends up leading him to Springer and eventually Hot Rod.


Heck, with Cobra-La being a thing, I could see them maybe working in Inhumanoids or Visionaries and saying Cobra-La is part of that, like a rogue faction or something. Not saying I would want it; just that I think Cobra-La could be a natural door to introducing one or both of them with out them feeling out of left feild or too forced.

 

[Sabrblade]

Matt Tracker's vigilante urban infrastructure repair crew (I'm not kidding)

V.U.I.R.C.?

 

[LordGigaIce]

V.U.I.R.C.?

Someone get ToyHax on it.

I could pretty easily see Rom working with Void Rivals and the Space stuff if done right. Set up the Space Knights as something like the Green Lanterns or Nova Corps; and them be kinda law enforcement for space. Have them slowly get pulled into things through other missions they are on. Like maybe ROM is investigating Skuxxoid's dealings, which leads him to the VR main characters which also ends up leading him to Springer and eventually Hot Rod.


Heck, with Cobra-La being a thing, I could see them maybe working in Inhumanoids or Visionaries and saying Cobra-La is part of that, like a rogue faction or something. Not saying I would want it; just that I think Cobra-La could be a natural door to introducing one or both of them with out them feeling out of left feild or too forced.

I agree with all of this.... I'd just like to see them take their time. IDW pushed the Revolution-verse out at once and in retrospect there were too many IPs not enough people cared about.
I think making Visionaries or Inhumanoids or Rom and the Space Knights work would require it taking time, and rolling them out slowly to let them feel established first.

 

[unluckiness]

Late stage IDW was when it became very apparent that somebody at the company desperately needed to tell the writers no.

 

[Sabrblade]

Maybe after the failure of Unit:E and the Aligned continuity Rik Alvarez snuck into the backdoor of IDW and clandestinely planted the idea of Revolution into everyone's minds there, just so he could finally get his stealth M.A.S.K comeback one way or another.

 

[Shadewing]

I agree with all of this.... I'd just like to see them take their time. IDW pushed the Revolution-verse out at once and in retrospect there were too many IPs not enough people cared about.
I think making Visionaries or Inhumanoids or Rom and the Space Knights work would require it taking time, and rolling them out slowly to let them feel established first.

Oh I agree it needs to be a slow and staggered release, just that unlike IDW, I can see how these properties could get folded in without feeling forced. IDW's TF and Joe books were completely seperate, till they decided to do this shared world. Then they also forced everything else in. But with EU, you have things like Skuxxoid and his black market-esque dealings, and secret underground society that is very anti-tech and otherworldly. Both of which can be doors to intro other stuff, it jsut feels like there is natural room for things to slot in if they wanted to use them. It could be interesting seeing Cobra-La as part of Inhumanoids lore considering how monsterous some of them can look.

 

[lastmaximal]

Maybe after the failure of Unit:E and the Aligned continuity Rik Alvarez snuck into the backdoor of IDW and clandestinely planted the idea of Revolution into everyone's minds there, just so he could finally get his stealth M.A.S.K comeback one way or another.

It stings because I really really wanted a MASK comeback. But it always made more sense as something that could happen as a subset of GI Joe (an impression helped along by the Matt Trakker they did for 25th) rather than as one of many things they spun up out of nothing and then expected people to care about.

 

[Sabrblade]

It stings because I really really wanted a MASK comeback. But it always made more sense as something that could happen as a subset of GI Joe (an impression helped along by the Matt Trakker they did for 25th) rather than as one of many things they spun up out of nothing and then expected people to care about.

It might sting more to hear that Alvarez's plans for MASK as a subset of Unit:E actually changed the acronym for seemingly no reason. Instead of the "Mobile Armored Strike Kommand", the were to have been the "Mechanically Advanced Secret Knights".

Or at least, that's what he claimed at one of his TFcon panels among many other bonkers claims pertaining to the Aligned continuity.

 

[lastmaximal]

Oh, that doesn't affect me at all. I've long known to try and keep Alvarez' ideas at arms' length. He might as well have come up with "Muscular Aardvark Saves Kalamazoo" and I'd be like of course he did.

That might actually be less dumb than this one.