Transformers: Age of the Primes toyline discussion || update: Wave 1 Box Art

[Sabrblade]

Y'know, if Star Optimus is how he was when he was one of the 13, that makes the presence of Micromaster Hot Rod with him really kinda weird.

Think of it more like how Kingdom Rodimus Prime was a big throwback to his debut in TFTM, but also came with the non-cartoon/comic-only accessory of the Sword of Primus. It's a blending of different lores and continuities sold together in one package.

He comes with Micromaster Hot Rod because the original toy did, which was part of JG1 lore. While his being one of the ancient Thirteen was never the case before now, as it was Aligned Optimus who held that status in the Covenant book. So, Hasbro's picking and choosing different aspects from different lores and putting them together to make a new lore.

 

[LordGigaIce]

Honestly? One of the many, many reasons TFO not doing that well sucked is because the idea of Zeta Prime as the Thirteenth will probably stay a one shot thing.

I don't really care for Optimus as the Thirteenth at all (I don't think anyone does) and don't want it to stick around.

But this new Star Convoy toy looks baller and I'll probably get it so...

 

[Sabrblade]

Honestly? One of the many, many reasons TFO not doing that well sucked is because the idea of Zeta Prime as the Thirteenth will probably stay a one shot thing.

Well, it's not the first time someone other than Optimus was given the Thirteenth Prime status. Machinima's Titans Return cartoon willfully disregarded the Optimus option and chose to make Sentinel the thirteenth instead.

 

[CoffeeHorse]

I hated the idea of Optimus as the Thirteenth, but tying the idea to his Star Convoy form is interesting. They might be on to something.

 

[Sabrblade]

I hated the idea of Optimus as the Thirteenth, but tying the idea to his Star Convoy form is interesting. They might be on to something.

It's certainly the most interesting take on the idea, thus far.

 

[Shadewing]

Right now, with the blue sphere with the Arisen symbol on it; which I know is supposed to be the Zodiac, but my mind is thinking more long the lines of Optimal Optimus; This is Optimus after merging with 13th's spark. The Star designation being due to 13's symbol being star-like.

 

[TriBlurr]

Eh. I know from asking Evan on Instagram that at least the design team consider the 13th to be pre-reincarnation Optimus Prime.

So my guess is that Star Convoy is now his form when he was the 13th. And he eventually regained his divinity when Rodimus/Hot Rod brought him back using the Zodiac. Which might be his artifact now.

Mark might give more insight when he does a BTS post for it.

 

[Haywire]

Is he a big deal, though? Until the 13, his biggest claim to fame was a one page spread with no set-up at the end of a comic series that sold so badly it got canceled after 12 issues. Even then, he no longer even has his biggest hook (being the progenitor of the Decepticons) because they gave that to the guy named after Megatron, which is why they turned him into robot-Loki for so long.

Is it Canon that the Decepticons have to come from only one of the Thirteen Primes, though? Yeah, Megatron took his name from Megatronus (who took his name from Megatron, which ought to cause some kind of Timey-Wimey paradox), but there's Thirteen Primes and only 2 main factions. (Assuming Maximals and Predacons are still descendants of Autobots and Decepticons, and Minicons may or may not be from Unicron.) Seems like there's room for Decepticons to come from both Megatronus and Liege Maximo, even if The Fallen gets top billing?

 

[LordGigaIce]

Is it Canon that the Decepticons have to come from only one of the Thirteen Primes, though? Yeah, Megatron took his name from Megatronus (who took his name from Megatron, which ought to cause some kind of Timey-Wimey paradox), but there's Thirteen Primes and only 2 main factions. (Assuming Maximals and Predacons are still descendants of Autobots and Decepticons, and Minicons may or may not be from Unicron.) Seems like there's room for Decepticons to come from both Megatronus and Liege Maximo, even if The Fallen gets top billing?

Most continuities seem to flip-flop on whether a member of the Thirteen was "the first Decepticon" or if Megatron just took inspiration from Megatronus' legacy. There's no clear answer. It changes depending on who's writing what.

Eh. I know from asking Evan on Instagram that at least the design team consider the 13th to be pre-reincarnation Optimus Prime.

View attachment 24820

So my guess is that Star Convoy is now his form when he was the 13th. And he eventually regained his divinity when Rodimus/Hot Rod brought him back using the Zodiac. Which might be his artifact now.

Mark might give more insight when he does a BTS post for it.

If Optimus as the Thirteenth is an awkward story beat to work into actual fiction (as evidenced by most fiction trying to work around it somehow) then maybe it was a bad idea?

Well, it's not the first time someone other than Optimus was given the Thirteenth Prime status. Machinima's Titans Return cartoon willfully disregarded the Optimus option and chose to make Sentinel the thirteenth instead.

I always thought that was the Machinina show's awkward attempt to try and fit in a plug for Sentinel's TR toy

 

[Sabrblade]

And in Earth Wars, the Thirteenth Prime is instead Nova Prime.

 

[LordGigaIce]

And in Earth Wars, the Thirteenth Prime is instead Nova Prime.

I missed that entirely

 

[PrimalxConvoy]

Eh. I know from asking Evan on Instagram that at least the design team consider the 13th to be pre-reincarnation Optimus Prime.

View attachment 24820

So my guess is that Star Convoy is now his form when he was the 13th. And he eventually regained his divinity when Rodimus/Hot Rod brought him back using the Zodiac. Which might be his artifact now.

Mark might give more insight when he does a BTS post for it.

TBH, I don't care what Mark says; Star Convoy is NOT one of the 13 Primes, IMO. He's simply a a suped-up version of Optimus/Convoy. Optimus was never destined to be a god-like being; he's just a regular bot and that's what's so special about him.

 

[Haywire]

TBH, I don't care what Mark says; Star Convoy is NOT one of the 13 Primes, IMO. He's simply a a suped-up version of Optimus/Convoy. Optimus was never destined to be a god-like being; he's just a regular bot and that's what's so special about him.

I mean, if "being one of the Thirteen" got him a new toy, then Mark can say whatever he wants; it's not like any of our collections are immutably beholden to official fiction.

On a side note: Hey, Mark, if you're reading this, I have it on reasonably strong authority that Targetmaster Blurr with Haywire is the modern embodiment of the secret Fourteenth Prime, Reallyfastimus, so you might want to make room in a future AotP wave...

 

[NovaSaber]

If Optimus as the Thirteenth is an awkward story beat to work into actual fiction (as evidenced by most fiction trying to work around it somehow) then maybe it was a bad idea?

Yep. I mean it's awkward even in it's original context of Aligned since he had to be be completely unaware of it for it to make sense even there, and it contradicts the themes of him coming from more humble origins no matter what.
Even for this figure it's unnecessary, since the Zodiac would be a perfectly suitable relic for The Last Autobot.
And the Last Autobot would be a much better thirteenth member than Optimus, or even than Zeta, Sentinel, Nova, etc., because the Matrix is Prima's relic and the Matrix bearers are his successors (not reincarnations).

 

[PrimalxConvoy]

I mean, if "being one of the Thirteen" got him a new toy, then Mark can say whatever he wants; it's not like any of our collections are immutably beholden to official fiction.

On a side note: Hey, Mark, if you're reading this, I have it on reasonably strong authority that Targetmaster Blurr with Haywire is the modern embodiment of the secret Fourteenth Prime, Reallyfastimus, so you might want to make room in a future AotP wave...

Yes, that's true. I'm sure some shoe-horning is required to convince the bean-counters at Hasbro to allow certain figures to be produced, but regardless, I'll be looking for another character to be the actual Prime in that pantheon instead.

 

[LordGigaIce]

I mean, if "being one of the Thirteen" got him a new toy, then Mark can say whatever he wants; it's not like any of our collections are immutably beholden to official fiction.

Ultimately, yeah. I really dislike the idea of Optimus as the Thirteenth but I'm really digging this new Star Convoy and will probably make it my first Titan.

I can just toss the Jewish Christmas ornament he comes with to PRiD Ultra Magnus who I'm repurposing as Zeta Prime to make him my collection's "Thirteenth." I'm not bound by what's official, just my own head canon

Yep. I mean it's awkward even in it's original context of Aligned since he had to be be completely unaware of it for it to make sense even there, and it contradicts the themes of him coming from more humble origins no matter what.
Even for this figure it's unnecessary, since the Zodiac would be a perfectly suitable relic for The Last Autobot.
And the Last Autobot would be a much better thirteenth member than Optimus, or even than Zeta, Sentinel, Nova, etc., because the Matrix is Prima's relic and the Matrix bearers are his successors (not reincarnations).

Agreed. I think it's telling that all of Optimus' most famous predecessors (Nova, Zeta, Sentinel) have had their turn being the Thirteenth, because they're all preferable to Optimus.
IDW conjured "the Arisen" out of nothing to wiggle out of it, and then just said "whoever happens to have the Matrix is the Thirteenth Prime." Which, depending on the continuity, could work to make Nova, Zeta, Sentinel, Optimus, and Rodimus all "the Thirteenth" all in the same universe!

"Optimus is a reincarnated god and always destined to be the Most Special Boy" is such a lame idea that not only went against Aligned's own established fiction up to that point (establishing Orion/Optimus as being descended from both Alpha Trion and Prima) but it's also been avoided like the plague by almost every iteration of the franchise since.

But.... that Star Convoy does look pretty cool... so if this is what Mark and Evan and the rest have to tell themselves to justify it then whatever.

 

[Platypus Prime]

On the whole 'distorted legends' concept, somehow I have this idea of a Minicon who has heard of Rodimus Prime and Optimus, seen some very degraded old pictures from the distant past, and comes up with the idea of styling himself as Rodimus, thinking where the Matrix would go is where a cockpit might fit, and then starts an all Minicon retelling of The Big O.

TO THE HEAD CANON THREAD!...

 

[Undead Scottsman]

Y'all act like this isn't a franchise built on 40 years of questionable continuity decisions.

For this toyline Star Optimus Prime is one of the original 13, oh well?

People acting like it's a slap in the face or something.

 

[TriBlurr]

I mean, it's all kind of moot at the end of the day since none of this stuff gets accompanying fiction anymore.

I can say Grimlock is the 13th and nobody at Hasbro is gonna beat down my door to yell at me.

I honestly wouldn't mind seeing the reincarnation story at least attempted to be told in a meaningful way. But I don't think we'll see that unless maybe Skybound decide to try it and that seems unlikely.

 

[LordGigaIce]

Y'all act like this isn't a franchise built on 40 years of questionable continuity decisions.

For this toyline Star Optimus Prime is one of the original 13, oh well?

People acting like it's a slap in the face or something.

I don't think anyone is acting like it's a slap in the face or anything. The decision to make Optimus the Thirteenth has never been popular, and this toyline is specifically referencing it, so of course it's gonna come up again.