Star Trek: The Original Series and The Next Generation

[Donocropolis]

Perhap. Maybe.

I always err on the side of the creator. If Gene Roddenberry had not walked away from Star Trek the Original Series in the 60’s after Season 2, we would have gotten a much better Season 3. We probably would have gotten more seasons of the Orignal Series because Gene would have been there fighting for us with his clout as creator and producer of Star Trek. The studio angered Gene by breaking their promise to him to keep Star Trek in the prime time Thursday night slot and moved it to weekends on Sunday nights. That’s why he left at the beginning of Season 3, and why the episode quality went down. Imagine a Season 4, 5, 6,…..10 under his watch.

If you've never seen the Animated Series, it's worth a watch. It's basically Season 4 of the original series.

Be careful what you wish for because when Mark Taylor left Mattel and George Lucas sold Stars Wars to Disney, we just got crappy products ever since. I would not be surprised if Gene was still the admiral of the flleet behind the scenes of next gen; he was just no longer captaining the individual ships.

Eh. I have similar feelings about George Lucas as I do with Gene. Both had great "seed" ideas for these worlds, but they need the input of others to really make them great. Star Wars episodes 4-6 all had a LOT of contributions by other people, while the significantly weaker Episodes 1-3 were 100% George Lucas now that he was "too big" to be forced to compromise his ideas.

I would agree that the Disney Star Wars movies have left a lot to be desired, some of the shows like The Mandalorian and Andor have been good to great. I haven't gotten around to watching a lot of the animated shows like Clone Wars / Rebels / Bad Batch, etc, but I've heard very good things about them as well.

 

[G.B.Blackrock]

Perhap. Maybe.

I always err on the side of the creator. If Gene Roddenberry had not walked away from Star Trek the Original Series in the 60’s after Season 2, we would have gotten a much better Season 3. We probably would have gotten more seasons of the Orignal Series because Gene would have been there fighting for us with his clout as creator and producer of Star Trek. The studio angered Gene by breaking their promise to him to keep Star Trek in the prime time Thursday night slot and moved it to weekends on Sunday nights. That’s why he left at the beginning of Season 3, and why the episode quality went down. Imagine a Season 4, 5, 6,…..10 under his watch.

Be careful what you wish for because when Mark Taylor left Mattel and George Lucas sold Stars Wars to Disney, we just got crappy products ever since. I would not be surprised if Gene was still the admiral of the flleet behind the scenes of next gen; he was just no longer captaining the individual ships.

Interesting that you mention Star Wars. I actually had it in mind to comment on how the original trilogy (when Lucas had to share creative control with others) tends to be considered far superior to what came with the prequel trilogy (which was almost all Lucas).

So, no, while the creator deserves due credit for... well, creating, I've learned not to "err on" that person's side.

 

[Sabrblade]

Gene Roddenberry forbade any real conflict between the main bridge casts of both TOS and TNG. Everyone was supposed to always get along with each other and rarely ever argue. That kind of thinking doesn't make for very engaging television if everybody's always squeaky-clean nice and goody-goody to each other.

 

[ooo-baby]

Gene Roddenberry forbade any real conflict between the main bridge casts of both TOS and TNG. Everyone was supposed to always get along with each other and rarely ever argue. That kind of thinking doesn't make for very engaging television if everybody's always squeaky-clean nice and goody-goody to each other.

This is not a good look:

Shatner would not have allowed this on the set of the Orignal Series. He was the star and Leonard Nimoy and the writers respected that.

Patrick Stewart was not the star of Next Gen. Jonathan Frakes kept taking command of the show away from him at will.

 

[Kalidor]

Yeah but that didn't actually happen. It was a simulation.

 

[ooo-baby]

Yeah but that didn't actually happen. It was a simulation.

True.

Nevertheless Shatner would not allow such a scene written for him. He had Roddenberry’s ear. The writing had to pass muster with him, to make him look good mister.

William Shatner could control the screen shots and camera angles so that he would be front and center, to make him look good and put him in the best light, with the most face time. That way there would be no doubt who the star and alpha of the show was at all times. Just ask Sulu.

 

[Kalidor]

I would have to double check but I'm certain there's probably at least one instance of imposter Kirk being berated. But I can't think of anything off hand so I guess I'll take your word for it for now.

 

[Dekafox]

While TOS was centered very much around the Kirk/Spock/McCoy trifecta, and Next Generation started off with reused Phase II scripts written with the same idea, TNG quickly became an ensemble show, and set the mold until Discovery(which focused in primarily on a single character again).

I can't remember the exact details of who became who, but Riker and Troi were originally meant to be Decker and Ilea in those early scripts, I'm pretty sure. I think the Vulcan Xon(who never made it into TMP) became Data?

 

[Ryougabot]

This scene would have killed Star Trek if it was aired today:

I don't know, we could use a little less fear of words today

 

[Kalidor]

If we can't do it today it's because there's an entire swath of people who will poop their diaper if they hear a word they find "offensive" because they lack the mental fortitude to understand context and nuance.

 

[ooo-baby]

The Original Series had such beautiful scenes:

and soft, feminine, beautifully dressed and made up women.

The rest of the Star Trek series starting with Next Gen masculinized females, made them look like boys, gave them hard, stoic personalities, with unisex uniforms. They’re like repressed robots until this happens:

What can you expect with a captain whose first officer constantly challenges him:

 

[The Predaking]

The first officer's job is to advise the captain and give him options. Then once the captain chooses a course of action, its Riker's job to carry that out. Riker does this perfectly in the series.

 

[ooo-baby]

The first officer's job is to advise the captain and give him options. Then once the captain chooses a course of action, its Riker's job to carry that out. Riker does this perfectly in the series.

I just feel Kirk’s first officer respected him more:

 

[The Predaking]

Spock was captain of the Enterprise at that point and Kirk was taking command for the mission. Spock knew that Kirk was one of the best Captains of the fleet and he outranked him as admiral, and had no ego to get in the way of Kirk taking command.

 

[Tuxedo Prime]

Well, why do you think Will Riker stayed XO for 15 years and passed up enough starship command opportunities to make the Office of the Detailer a bit nervous?

 

[Dekafox]

The XO is also supposed to handle the day-to-day nitty gritty running of the ship, so the Captain can concentrate on the bigger picture. It's also their job to tell the Captain when they are wrong, which is why there's a great deal of trust required between those two positions for a ship to run well. If they don't, then either the two will end up working at cross-purposes at some point, or eventually the Captain will screw up by the numbers in a way that could have been otherwise prevented if the XO had spoken up earlier.

 

[ooo-baby]

Riker’s dad was also a hothead in this Original Series episode:

but Kirk knew how to handle him.

 

[The Predaking]

Riker's dad? His dad wouldn't have been old enough to be in the TOS era. Remember Kirk was out saving the galaxy when Picard's grand father was in diapers.

 

[ooo-baby]

Here’s the real story:

 

[ooo-baby]

Kirk and Spock complemented each very well:

The Next Gen movies tried to remind us of the chemistry and magic by giving Data second billing to Picard, and pushing Riker into the background as an extra, a bit actor.

Data could have gotten a better send off (eg. like Spock in “The Wrath of Khan”).